Corrections and clarifications about some stuff you may have read in the press

Clear. It’s always been clear to the majority of people. Whatever happenned to good old-fasioned trust.

Whatever happened to good old-fashioned accurate reporting!

That is why blogging isn’t regarded as journalism.

…and these days the difference is what exactly, again? Journalists have been quoted saying (loosely the equivalent of) “our job is to report the facts, not second-guess them”. No comment…

I’d say bloggers are more likely to respond to errors and make corrections in a timely manner.

But the impact of a popular blog is still bigger than that of a not as popular news site… Or worse, news sites hiring bloggers that speculate too much…

I guess that last thing already happens too much. Sadly.

And the difference between what you described and an editorial is?

Are you aware of the irony of doing down blogging as journalism on a site devoted to a do-it-yourself computer that’s intended to open up access to computer science?

If you watch Leveson, you’ll realize it never existed…….

Very Clear! :)

Chaos is never fun to deal with. best of luck clearing it up Liz!

Clear.
Looking forward to get mine :)

Greetz,
benni

Thanks for pointing that out. In my case it clarifies even before I could get confused as I haven’t come across mentioned article yet ;)
But you also bring up some pieces of informatione you otherwise would have to dig for in the rather lively forums. I didn’t know (or maybe I forgot) the edu boards will come with a case, a stack and a manual.
Also it’s great to read that as soon as you got the first batch everyone will be able to buy one in the online shop. Maybe some people were wondering if you would allow preorders of any kind, if normal users would have a chance of receiving a batch #1 device or if you had already sold most or all of them in advance..

My problem about lack of pre-orders is I have a feeling that the first batch of 10,000 will sell out in a few minutes, and I won’t get a chance to get my order in. So, assuming they sell out fast, how long will it take to get a second batch in? I’m assuming that since all the manufacturing kinks are worked out, that would be 2-3 weeks, correct?

For those people that are scared that the first batch will sell-out instantly and that a pre-order system would give them a chance… what makes you think that the pre-order system wouldn’t also sell out instantly? All that would have happened is that the “there are no more RaspPi’s to sell” point would have been moved forward in time. My only hope is that if they do sell out instantly, they do so to people who understand what they are buying. I’d hate to see a rush on them followed by 9999 comments in the forum asking “but how do I make it run Windows?”

Quite. Not sure that people who ask for preordering have really thought it through.

The pre-ordering would do 2 things:
1) more people are likely to order when the product is available (a bird in the hand, so to speak), rather than pre-order. That itself would give those pre-ordering a better chance.
2) If there are 50,000 pre-orders, then they will know to have 50,000 in the first batch instead of 10,000.

Windows on ARM. Possibly not as far off as you might think.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16980442

Windows on Raspberry Pi – probably furthur off than you think.

(sorry)

Sadly the system requirement of WOA appear to be beyond what the Pi will be capable of for now. I’m not sure about the processor requirements but WOA needs a minimum of 1GB of RAM… according to wikipedia anyhow (thus it may not be entirely accurate)

For what it’s worth:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_8#Hardware_requirements

As the kids say, “LOLZ”. For so many young people, “Windows” and “computer” go together like “peanut” and “butter” (sorry for the Americanism). I’m looking forward to showing to kids what THEY can do with a computer sans Windows.

It made a difference, since you can get an idea of how many pieces you are going to sell, at least. It would have helped out to adjust the number of orders to the manufacture company. Even more, would have helped people to know how long they need to wait before getting a chance to buy on the first, second, third or whatever batch.

Even if there is no a pre-order system on the sell yet, I think it will help you out anyway in the future.

I will try to buy it the first day though :P

“It made a difference, since you can get an idea of how many pieces you are going to sell,”

It might have made a difference! Though not necessarily for good. I really liked RasPi people’s approach to this, which is less risky. Maybe because I’m a cautious type myself. From life experience, when it’s about business, less than 50% of risky people get there, and more than 50% of the cautious people. For me it was one of the signs that “these guys really mean get the job done appropriately”.

Anyways you might want to think like this, “Let it be late, but let it be merry” :) [it’s an Armenian saying, and it rhymes in the original]

Except there is the issue of funding which is always the limitation of how many you can order at any one time. Even if you know you can sell 100k you may not be able to afford to build 100k in one go. The Foundation has a business plan which takes all that in to account.

Just to point something out. If the Raspberry PI team collected pre-orders that would imply recieving the funds immediately instead of some time in the future. That being said wouldn’t the virtue of that fact alone mean the following batch be manufactured sooner?

Actually under UK distance selling rules, anything anything that’s mail ordered has it’s payment placed in escrow until dispatch. Most of the time it’s done by the CC company as a pending payment, but sometimes the supplier provides the escrow. Raspi Foundation wouldn’t even have their hands on the funds until the batch is dispatched.

So there wouldn’t be any advantage really.

Extremely clear and never in doubt :-)

No surpise on the sloppy way it was reported on Tomshardware. I remember back in the day when Toms was the place to go for accurate, timely, info and reviews. Now its just a way for a bunch of tek guys to make money :-( Reviews, especially of hardware, are often wrong and inaccurate where even a tek noob can spot mistakes (like monitor reviews where the number of USB ports is said to be none but the picture shows 3!).

Anyway – thanks Liz and all for the front page update.

Tom’s hasn’t managed to be objective for, what, the last 8 years or so?

No – at least. But thank goodness for bit-tech.net

Stupid paparazzi always looking for more views & advertising money – even if it means hurting people. :-(
If this were 4chan, we would have LOIC-ed their IPs. But we are civilized, so they should be thankful for this and should post a retraction and apologies.

Really not Eurogamer’s fault. They’re a great team and they’re very keen to see Raspberry Pi succeed; I think some wires just got crossed, but then Tom’s indulged in a sort of Chinese whispers thing which compounded the problem.

I meant to ask – what was the hoo-hah about on the twitter with Wired? Was it to do with this?

Sorry to hear about the counter-hype journalism from Tom’s HW.

Ha – no, that was something else entirely. Wired asked us to give them a copy of our BOM. We told them we couldn’t do that because it’d land us in hot water with our suppliers (particularly Hynix and Broadcom); if their other customers were to use our BOM to demand similar pricing, we’d be in trouble. So instead, they *made up* a BOM (which was gratuitously wrong). They told us they were doing this, and we asked them not to; saying we’d be happier for no article to appear at all. They published it anyway. Our suppliers started getting calls from their other customers, as predicted; we had a lot of apologising to do.

Slightly less serious, but still damned annoying: Wired also wanted pictures of a cased version of the final board. This was well before Christmas, at which point we didn’t *have* any beta or final boards, still less any cased ones (the cases are being finished after the board themselves are finished at the end of this month). They didn’t take no for an answer, and kept asking, and asking, and asking…and then photoshopped a case onto an alpha board (wrong size, wrong proportions) for their magazine. Which is misleading, but it’s nothing like as damaging as their efforts with the BOM were.

Great way to deal with WIRED. You definitely earned some respect from me with that.

A mate of mine use to be the Executive Publisher of Wired. He’s not any more, but if you want, I can blame him and kick the crap out him for you?

Agreed with Michael Walters, that is a shocking thing that WIRED did to you. I hope your suppliers don’t hold this against you.

It’s always been clear to me, still is. It took me no time at all on my first visit here to work out that the $25 version has no NIC, the $35 does.
It’s a bit sad when online articles propagate such misleading information when all that’s needed is little more careful research before posting. Don’t stress too much though, if anyone is concerned they can check back here for the real information :-) Plus, aren’t you going back to that cool hotel on the cliff again soon ?

I wondered what happened to the News Of The World reporters. It seems all journalism is these days is a way to try and panic people with false information and incorrect claims. There is less journalism and more editorials dressed up to pretend to be journalism.

Again, I should really make it clear that this wasn’t Eurogamer’s fault; it just seems David wasn’t particularly clear in what he was saying. I’d save my ire for Tom’s Hardware, who went for a really needlessly aggressive headline to accompany the thing which (read the comments under their post) has really set the vapourware cats among the “Crapberry Puke” pigeons.

Liz, the better the RPi is, unfortunately, the more vile the haters will be :-( A sad reflection on the times we live in

But hope you all know theres…. 10k+ lovers here and probably another 100k likers on the mailing list

“Crapberry Puke” pigeons.

Microsoft Fanbois?

Sounds like a possible name RIM’s next offering.

I really enjoyed the “haters gunna hate” internet meme.

That’s a bit harsh, this seems to be more a misunderstanding (with the exception of Toms Hardware, who are dreadful).

Now, if the report had come from rifling through Liz’ bins, then you could blame the NotW!

As with lots of popular brand, soon Raspberry Pi will acquire an equally large base of “haters” who which to destroy the success.

You’re not successful until you have haters :p

First they ignore you. Then they laugh at you. Then they fight you. Then you win

The best video response for your post: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XEujPG7Zjw

Tomshardware/Eurogamer should check there source details…and strange as it may seem why not..check Raspberry Pi itself..Toms & Euro gamer are Websites that have been around for years and should no better..ive sent some links and info to them and show that blogs can get there information corect..why not the big boys.
Poor Liz..

Talas

http://wave4k.blogspot.com/

To be fair, it seems Eurogamer did, and David sent them a not-very-clear clarification before they went to press (he forwarded it to me earlier). The problem was just a use of the word “commercial” where he should have said “educational”, which he repeated in the clarification!

What dissapoints me is the fact that the TH guys did contact the RPi, but simply decided to “produce” some information as they did not accept no for an answer.
And, since they really did not like the answer, in fact the whole article damaged the RPi a lot.
But, rest assured, there are guys around that kept your back – I already calmed few of my friends as soon as I found the pre-order information ;)

We found that they did mail us (in the middle of the night, UK time, when we were asleep) – Eben responded to them as soon as he saw the mail, but the article had already been posted by the time we were awake and in front of a computer. Part of the time zone dividend, I’m afraid.

You probably will have to yell at Tom’s another time for not understanding that this:

Back in December, we heard that the Raspberry Pi mini PC would be available in January. As you’ve probably noticed, it’s already February, and the only availability we’ve seen is through eBay for upwards of $2500. Obviously, many people don’t have a couple of grand lying around to blow on a computer willy-nilly, and there was only a limited number of them available through the auctioning site. However, it seems Raspberry Pi is on track to launch for real this month.

was more of a charity thing and not “lol we ebay them for 100 times their value one at a time, get screwed”.

I used to be a fan of Toms Hardware.
Whilst working for a large motherboard manufacturer I met some guys from Toms Hardware at Cebit including Tom himself.
I found them to be rude, obnoxious and unpleasant.
I stopped reading Toms Hardware.

Crystal clear, although I never needed those explanations… Some journalists better check their sources twice before publishing something –‘

Is the 35$ price tag tax included? If not, how much is it?

Tax is not included in that price. But schools (at least in the UK; I’m not sure about tax regimes elsewhere in the world off the top of my head) and other non-profit organisations won’t have to pay VAT, and if you’re outside the EU, you won’t have to pay VAT either. Import duties will depend on where you live.

Unless you’re a VA school shelling out more than £2000 in one go for anything – then you have to pay VAT and can’t claim it back. Our School Business Manager is on the warparth….HMRC is currently demanding back-VAT from us….

i dont get it, a company or school for that matter should only pay vat if they intend to sell an item, do you mean you have to pay vat and reclaim it later? if its for use not resale you shouldnt pay vat. i work in the health service and we claim back vat on anything we buy

Yes, but you get charged it initially, supplying to Education in the UK is a bit more compliacted than ‘… won’t have to pay VAT’ VAT registered business’s have to charge VAT to all UK schools, it is just that LEA Schools effectively recover the VAT (Their budgets are set ‘EX VAT’)
Private schools and Charities have to pay VAT and AIUI non LEA schools like Academy’s have an ‘adjustment’ made to their funding.

That’s exactly what I thought when I read the Tom’s Hardware article last night. Frankly, I appreciate the fact that it’ll give me a mildly better chance to buy one when they show up on the site, but it’s bad, wrong, and I really hope they offer a retraction, change, and apology.

Guess you’ll just have to prove them wrong in ~2 weeks when the first boards start shipping! :)

I honestly don’t get why everyone seems so interested in seeing you guys fail. Between the /. idiot brigade and now parts of the press, it’s like they’re all hoping what you’ve all promised fails rather than pushing you to succeed. Sad little minds.

You rock, Liz. I saw this before I saw any of the others. Thanks for getting on top of it so quickly.

A) Liz, have you had your beatification letter from the Vatican yet? You really do seem to have the patience of a saint!

B) Really good news for the educational sector that you are aiming to include a case in the price! Not that that helps *me*, but I don’t need that help – schools do!

I hope Liz isn’t Beatified.
You have to be DEAD first!

OK – Notice of intended. Hopefully not for many decades, but you got my drift ;)

Thankfully the first I heard about the lax “reporting” was on this site. I dont think many of the haters appreciate the idea behind the raspi and thats why they distrust the price of the board.
I get the need to press etc, but I’m not going to believe anything about the raspi unless its on this site.

Roll on Feb 20th.

Oh, well. I just read the official news. It is, the news direct from this blog.
Other media news is just speculation.

Journalists failing to understand and misreporting things, well I never!

You’re the greatest Liz. Don’t fret too much, if people are serious about wanting a slice of the Pi then they will do their own research and come to their own conclusions. Who believes what the pree says anyway? Wired have brought their disdain upon themselves, hopefully the other reporting medias will learn from their mistake!

Crystal ;)

Wishing you all strength, patience and rest.

Tom’s has gone way down hill, from hand off to hand off. Certainly not the same site it was ten years ago.

Supportive Hug, to you Liz!

You missed the Tahoe snow by a week. ;-))

Still intending on going some time in March – I just hope it snows a bit more before then!

What did show up is now skied away. :-(
I’m now worried about having drinking & Ag water come late summer / early fall.

For skiing, check out Baniff or Whistler BC Canada, or maybe Europe. I see in the news reports, people using skis to just get around in parts of Europe.

Tell Eben I’ve not sent the “Ransom” poster yet. Not to worry, he will have it for his office, after I talk a picture of a R-Pi next to it.

Again, You and the R-Pi Team have done & are doing OUTSTANDING Jobs!

Sadly, our season tickets are for Heavenly and Northstar, so we’re hoping for snow!

Very clear, but it was clear too

For RasPi news i come directly here, not via some commercially motivated content aggregator (I prefer hearing horses speak for themselves and i never trust a whispering-asian).

Haters:
Who exactly could have anything unpleasant to say about the RasPi team/device/project/foundation? What bit of what they are doing is not awesome? OK, Broadcom arent gonna do too badly out of it but even as a commerical company they are apparently cooperating and collaborating in the desired spirit (well done BCM).

‘device xxx’ is way better than the RasPi:
OK off you go then – more stock from the first batch for those of us who want to follow the true goals of the project and *participate in the community*. Oh, and yeah, XBMC on RasPi – that should be a tertiary concern at best for any purchaser.

money, money, money… who cares? :
If there was a commercial and educational price option (think MS Academic Licensing) I would understand if i couldnt get it at the lower educational price, in the same way that I cant currently buy MS Office for £35.
Even if the price point was $50/B I would still buy (more than) one – the reason Raspberry are aiming at this price is to make it affordable for educational projects (from school funding). Yeah, i have some plans later to use the devices extensively in my house and hopefully commercially too but right now I would just like it for me and my 5 year old son to actually get our hands (computer) dirty with some small home projects with the RasPi and maybe a bit of lego ;-).

Raspberry keep it up – dont let these idiots muddy the waters. The devices will be ready when they are ready, i hope I can get a Batch1 device but I will understand if i can’t; the suspense in the interim however is killing me! :-)

it would be desirable to specify, cost of delivery to Russia

Please read the FAQ. There’s a link at the top of the page.

I thank you, very wait his purchase

I like release dates. They protect me from freaking out on every Google Reader new post.

Sad to hear so much skepticism surrounding the project at this point. At least damage control may be able to turn this around.

Well, it’s not *that* bad – I think any project that attracts this much interest gets some weird comments. And as far as damage limitation goes: although Tom’s haven’t amended their post, it *does* seem that nobody has copied their story, which is good news. And Eurogamer were brilliant.

Hallelujah. Tom’s Hardware have updated their post. (It’s now so confused that *I* couldn’t understand it, but it’s a significant improvement.)

Thanks guys for clarify. I’m just anxious to start playing with one.

Toms hardware turned into a joke after they were bought out. I haven’t trusted them for years and they used to be one of my main go tos for tech news.

I hope you all get this sorted out! I tried to help spread the word as well about the correct information.

I always thought the dates were crystal in the first place, and happily, I never saw the lunacy in the press. I gave up on both Tom’s and Wired years ago.

Now all I want is for the stock levels to be high enough for you to tell me, “take two, they’re small.”

I feel for you and the team, must be hard to deal with this when all you would like to do is work on the actual product =) I used to read TH in early 2000ish but stopped when I thought they lost track of things (IMO).

I hope you guys can leave this behind you as fast as possible. I´m looking forward to my own Raspberry Pi =)

Sound like someone somewhere needs to be fired for either saying untruth or not listening correctly.. LOL.

Wait! – Something on the Internet was WRONG you say?

:)

I know – hard to believe, but apparently so.

You mean to say that those cows nodding in the AirPlay video were a fake?! :o

I might be wrong, but it seems similar to Nazi Germany.

I call a deliberate Godwyn!
Nice one!

What are you doing to make sure your shop can stand slashdotting, redditing and all other forms of super high requests/second?

It’s not hosted by us, but by an e-commerce setup in the US who have servers of steel.

Thanks for your calm response to the challenges of the day. Quite an education in itself :)

Wouldn’t be better to use servers made of silicon? :-)
(Unless they use some secret Babbage design)

what about the rest of the site? i’m sure there was talk of moving to a new server but the site still seems unsteady right now.

I think raspberry.org site is not in its best. Maily because its like a blog, and should not be like that. I think two or three things made clear in the front page would be effective in avoiding some of these confusions:

Header (fixed)
– Date of the first batch (Model B only)
– Case (…)
– Price …
– Model A (features / schematics)
– Model B (features / schematics)

Next:
your usual blog posts …

It wouldn’t have any effect on sloppy journalists writing horror stories based on misheard rumours.

It’s probably a side effect of commercial 24-hour news – it’s possible to publish inaccurate and sometimes outright wrong stories considerably faster than one can publish fact-checked and accurate ones.

We’ve spent the evening talking about this; it’s interesting to note that another story that got real traction in the press was one where Eben appeared to be slagging Apple off (I really think we need to send the boys on a media training course…)

My feeling is that if a story is negative, then it gets more eyeballs. More eyeballs = more advertising bucks. Human nature, unfortunately.

Was that the one about the RaspPi having twice the GPU power of the iPhone 4S? I saw something to that effect on Ars Technica and a few other sites, but didn’t think it a bad thing, as it’s comparing two devices with very different characteristics. It seemed a point of comparison only, but I can see how the media would run with it.
Anything that mentions Apple tends to get coverage, especially if your product is described as “more than” or “better than” Apple’s in some way.
It’s sad that some parts of the media are determined to make drama where there is none. Keep your chin up though Liz, you’re just about at the point where people will be getting the boards in their hands, and all the hard work will start paying off. The amount of information you’ve provided to us through this site has been amazing, and I’m sure I’m not the only one who really appreciates it.

i am looking forward to get one !

Clear as a Raspberry. :))

[…] hands on the fairly powerful ARM powered computer, so naturally this post by Liz over at the official Raspberry Pi […]

The Tom’s Hardware feed on my moble reader has been updated with an apology.

Frankly I’m getting sick of this publicity because its the wrong kind. First of all, I’ve never been a fan of Tom’s Hardware because they’re incredibly biased. But what really bothers me is how people keep treating RPi like its going to be a great PC, and its not; and I feel like they just want to take advantage of the price. What RPi is intended for is exactly what its good at, along side being a decent low-power server or media center.

It wouldn’t bother me so much if these weren’t the same people who stereotype Linux as a terminal-based and hacker’s OS. These are the people who would buy RP and bitch about it because it can’t run Windows or doesn’t have all the hardware specs they’re looking for.

RPi is an insanely great product, but it isn’t meant for the average person.

It is very much meant for the average person. The trouble is the average person currently suffers from learned helplessness when it comes to computers. The aim is to change that.

AMEN to that!

What’s the problem here and why are people getting so excited?

Rpi it’s a cool toy, but hey you can get a 1ghz limited memory pc for less than $30 on ebay.

If it’s late who really cares no ones going to use it for education it’s a joke surely a novelty for playing with, bring back mind storm and be done with it.

Oh look, we have our first Troll comment!
Best to let him starve. Maybe he came from Tom’s Hardware! ;)

I love you Liz! *hugs*

Keep up the great work, and don’t let these annoyances get in the way for your love for this project, and the huge impact it will create for school children.

“Rpi it’s a cool toy, but hey you can get a 1ghz limited memory pc for less than $30 on ebay.”

[Citation needed]

For that matter, get me one with similar power consumption, footprint, graphical capabilities…

Will it hang neatly off the back of a short HDMI lead behind your TV, out of sight?

Todays Best Misunderstanding of the Concept award goes to JaseyJaseJas (what sort of handle is that?).

Not wishing to feed the trolls, but …

Mindstorms is an excellent first trainer, especially for GCSE and Key Stages students without prior control-systems knowledge. That is what it does.

For more in-depth access to control/programming/electronics you need an undedicated bare-board system.

I have a class of young people who want to learn about control and electronics (specifically robotics, because that’s what is ‘cool’), and the RasPi will fit the bill admirably in both price and hardware specification.

Linux is great – flexible and scalable if less accessible than Windows (mind you, the last time I used it was a pair of SuSE 8.0 fileservers I cobbled together). What’s more, it’s available at a great price! (When you have so many calls on your educational computing budget, price becomes a BIG factor).

All in all, RasPi looks to be a very useful ‘toy’ – a niche product that will probably fit several unexpected niches, and not just in education.

*/ Just my three-ha’penneth worth /*

[…] release’ that Eurogamer is articulate about is indeed a educational release,” reads a latest Raspberry Pi update. Raspberry Pi also reassures everybody that indication A will be $25 and indication B will cost […]

Clearer than my groundwater…
You guys rock, I can’t wait to get my RP. And no bad journalism is gonna change that.
Cheers!.

People with a set of mind like yours delay education and progress, if you don’t have anything good to contribute with you should take your negative comments somewhere else.
This is a positive community, going towards the goal of improving education.

My last comment was in response to jaseyjasejas.
I wasn’t quite getting the comment system.

I have great respect for you all. Thanks for the clarification and I look forward to ordering a machine from you soon! (sleep is not optional :-) )

[…] http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/633 This entry was posted in Uncategorized.Bookmark the permalink. […]

Here we go again. lol. Liz is going to start having to make the foundation pay for all the hair coloring that this stuff is causing. If it continues, this way, they may have to pay for a wig too!

Clear enough. :)

Hi,
I want to make one more thing clear about the great board Raspberry Pi.

The question is about the binary of first stage boot loader.

I think the binary is not an open source,
then how do I get the binary?

1. buy an SD card separately.
2. download the binary and use it for self built kernel.
3. some distributions include the binary for Raspberry Pi.

I hope some day I get the Raspberry Pi :)

Since the board will not run without the binary it comes with any SD image which is loadable form the Raspberry Pi website.

Will the disk images also boot USB drives off the bat? Or will that take longer to do (or not at all?)

Alas if there’s money in mud-slinging (traffic generating), guess what will happen?

At the end of the day,the product will do the talking so roll on the arrival of batches 1, 2, 3 …

Last time there were some pre-production boards I didn’t get a chance to get one. Now there will be probably 10 000 of them but I do have a question, can I or others that can prove they are distro developers make a reservation, just in case ?

Nope. First come, first served.

If you really are a distro person, you could email Liz and you may be put on a list. If there is a list. We always have some in reserve for marketing/promotional or other purposes that align with the aims of the Foundation.

Thanks , I’ll try and contact Liz. While I do understand the first come, first serve policy I think distro support is important and we, as devs need to have the hardware before the users get it so we can properly support it.

There are already a number of distro people who have alpha boards, so we are aware of the necessity. However, there are an awful lot of disparate Linux distro’s, so not everyone is going to get one – that would take most of the first batch, and its not just distro’s that are important to the foundation – it’s the software stack on top that also vital. These initial releases ARE intended for development, prior to the educational releases in about Q3.

Yes, I understand. One thing though, not that many distros out there with ARM support already working.
The one I work for ( Frugalware ) does have a stable ARM branch and it supports ARM 11.

WHY Are you selling half-a-computer
No Enclosed Box??
Is the Circuit Board Dustproof/Shockproof/MoistureProof

Because I googled about It and all I was found was some circuit (which later turned out to be raspberry pi mobo)

It better have an enclosing case (and not just squares. It should be elegant)

Coz Even if its Just $ 25, Its our hard earned money.

Why? Because we can.
Why? Because people want the bare board
Why? Because a case would take time and money to design and make
Why? Because a case will increase the cost of the device.
Why? Because it doesn’t really need a case at this stage

We will be selling a case late on for the educational edition. You wont be getting a cased version for $25. It’s not possible.

The circuit board is a circuit board – its not any more dustproof, shockproof or moisture proof than any other circuit board. That said, I have been carrying a bare board around with me in a rucksack and it always works. These devices are more robust than you might think.

@ AJ: What James said ….

Plus: What some of we engineer-types do is build a bare-board into a piece of equipment that we’re developing. I’d resent spending hard-won cash on a case that would be scrapped as soon as the equipment was bought.

If I want a case, I’ll engineer one myself, thanks.

Yes, but you could easily fashion the packaging to act as a case. Can’t be that difficicult. And unless you were planning on shipping in Jiffy bags, it should not make much difference to cost.

hmm, I’d prefer a lot more packing around a device that’s travelling by post than I’d like around that device once it’s sitting on my desk. If you make a nifty cut-and-fold template for producing a svelte cardboard case from the shipping box, I’m sure many people would thank you… :-)

A case doesn’t make it a computer. If you want a case, go down to your local electronics/hobbyist shop, buy one, and install it yourself. If you can’t do that, then you’re probably not the right kind of person to be buying and using this computer.

… yet!! But things will change by the time it launches for the education sector. :-)

You probably weren’t around at the beginning of the personal computer revolution. A bare board was the norm, and you’d solder in the components yourself. The Raspberry Pi will be prepopulated, making it a great hobby board that (I think) will bring some excitement back into the hobby. For education, it’s better to see what’s under the hood, but they’ll have cases anyway.
A lot of people have their own uses in mind, and a case wouldn’t work for them.
Lastly – you say $25 was hard earned? Really? That’s a few light lunches, a week’s worth of take-away coffees, or a night at the cinema. That’s *nothing* and I’m amazed at your demands upon a charity that owes you nothing.

I do agree that it is cheap enough but 25$ is not “nothing” for all the people. I am a student from a poor country and I waste about 50 euros per Month and anyway I think it’s a lot.

Agreed. And the foundation agrees too, which is why the price is what has been the most important thing to maintain.

If you’d like to see what a time and money pit a nice plastic casing can be, head over to openpandora.org and go looking through the news postings from 2009-2010, noting how many of them were just about trying to get a decent case made for the device. Granted, it was a more complex case than the RasPi, because it is a mini-laptop, but even so, the case saga is a real education as to what it takes to turn out a nicely packaged piece of electronics.

[IMHO] In one of Eben’s interviews he did acknowledge that many of the first batch boards are likely to be bought by people from the “maker community”. Plenty of stores sell bare Arduino boards to happy customers, so a bare RasPi board is not going to put them off, and if anything a bare board makes it clear that if you expect a nice turnkey system with lots of stable software available from the moment you take it out of the box, you’d be better served by waiting a bit longer until it becomes more like a traditional consumer product, instead of a fantastically nifty “component” that many people are very eager to work with.

Also, when you decide to put a case on a bare board and start selling it as a finished good, you’ll no doubt have to submit the device for RF emission testing, etc., in order to show CE compliance before you can start selling anything. Delay, fiddling, expense… but if you start selling bare boards first, you can do the case development and testing in parallel with actually getting units in front of early adopters who can deal with the RF/static protection/child safety aspects themselves.

[…] effettuare un solo ordine per persona (a causa dell’enorme richiesta), direttamente dal post : Sarà possibile acquistare il Raspberry Pi da fine Febbraio, da questo sito. La “release […]

Clarification appreciated, but not needed.
Best wishes to Raspberry Pi on the February 20-ish Pi-fest

I’ve got these $35 ready… set…

I had last a discussion with a journalist of a big technology website that states that publishing on the internet has evolved from a couple of hobbyist to “serious” educated journalism.

The problem is that with that “professionalism” the rate of tabloidism (I just made this up) and FUD just to fetch more viewers (which increases the number of hits that is very easy to sell to advertisers) has increased tremendous.

For a lot of sites (I look at http://slashdot.org or a dutch site like tweakers.net which in my head is famous for these shenanigans) it isn’t about correctly stating news but to spread the most inflammatory catchy news or even FUD to get their page views up which is good commercially. It is really sick if you think about it.

Agreed. Slashdot still has some good articles, but on the other hand, you see headlines that are a question rather than a concrete answer, which immediately sets it up for lots of speculation and little truth. Sometimes, even the summaries are wrong, or misinterpreting the actual article, on those kinds of posts.

Tom’s Hardware has good reviews, but I’d never read their reporting. I don’t know why there’s such a disparity but their round-ups and reviews are usually pretty good and thorough- their reporting team, however, is just a waste of time. I don’t know why they even bother with it.

prompt me please, when will purchase Raspberry Pi, in it the operating system will be set? if will not there be flesh of card, as I am necessary it will be to load the operating system?

I *think* all you ask has answers in the FAQ or Wiki.

from after difficulties of translation not quite took apart, and FAQ studied already, but so did not understand if SD will not supply, how to load the operating system

Perhaps wait until the documentation in your native language is released?

Oh the fun of auto translation – I recall reading one translated document referring to the ‘Sexual desire of the LED’.

I will not buy this tobacconist’s, it is scratched.

What is your native language Eduard?

What kind of journalist have you dealt with?what a…. anyway thanks for clarification and for this amazing project.can’t wait to have one of those in my hand.

so, i haven’t understood: the firsts boards wont be availible to buy from the first day. thanks!

This may be a language difficulty! You WILL be able to buy the boards from the first batch when they go one sale in the very near future – anyone can. The only issue might be that this first batch sells out very fast, so you will need to be quick!

Ok, thanks! I think also it was a language difficulty. I asked that because there is a mention to education sector, and i didn’t understood very good

Thanks for that. I hadn’t even heard the rumour from these third parties, but we have absolute faith the Raspberry Pi is going to be awesome, and available soon. I wait patiently with anticipation :)

Vaporware – I’ve been saying this all along. Good luck all of you waiting till Sep. Amazing how many people get fooled.

Twat. I’ve been saying this all along. Good luck to you being a twat for the rest of your life. Amazing how you have fooled so many people so far.

pmsl

+1

When will the boards be available to everbody?

Next week, all being well.

Since February 20 is my birthday, I’m happy to see a Linux Holiday happen on it. Planning on buying myself a couple Raspberry prezzies!

Clear enough.
Thank you very much for eveything.
I’m getting 1+ ;-)
J

This appears to be a great innovation and I’m very interested in purchasing one of your boards when available. I will need to find out the mailing/shipping costs to Australia when you have these.
Regards Geoff

I had a dream yesterday, the Raspberry Pi was finally available. I ordered it, went through Paypal, got the confirmation receipt by email. Then I woke up.

So cruel

Can I buy em yet??

soon! :)

I think we are due an update of some sort soon. It has been 8 days since any real news was posted. Any update from the factory? Pictures of an assembled unit for example. Would also be interesting to know what shipping costs will be? Or if you are going to China? Just something to keep people calm for another week and a bit.

I’d much rather they be preparing themselves and everybody else working so hard on this project for what is coming than quick fix low-content output. Give ’em a break. :-)

As soon as there is any news that can be told, it will be told. It is just as frustrating for everyone, but have a little more patience – it wont be long now… :)

Disgustingly busy with meetings and dealing with phone calls and emails at the moment; and there are two important pieces of news in particular which we can’t post about until certain boxes have been ticked. Keep your fingers crossed for a “real news” post in the next few days.

Interesting!

Tom’s Hardware has been removed from my bookmarks. Microsoft be aware: first 10000 Rpi linux machines are on the way. NEXT will be 100000.

I’m concerned about the advertised low price of RPi vs the price of a working setup which schools, universities and individuals will actually have to pay:

1. Raspberry Pi + HDMI monitor + keyboard + mouse + USB hub + power adapter + various cables -> cost in the region of £100 ex VAT to make it run as a mini PC with video output?

2. Scroll 7″ WiFi Tablet PC CE/FCC £58.32 ex VAT – all peripherals nicely integrated with WiFi and touch screen, power adapter.

3) If built-in video output is not required, there are already a number of tiny Linux boards and MCU development kits available in the UK for under £35 that can be used for teaching.

Can I ask WHY you are concerned about it?

1. Correct. Although many places already have the majority of that equipment already available.
2. Those things are rubbish, and even more rubbish if you want to learn to program on them, which is the base purpose of the Raspi. You still need to add mouse keyboard and monitor to make them useful. Which then makes them twice the price of the Raspi, for something not as good.
3. None/Few of them support Linux, with its associated plethora of compilers and available software. They often require a desktop PC to build software for them (e.g Arduino), which rather negate the point of the Raspi in the first place. And built in video is required. How do you propose doing programming courses when you cannot see what you are typing?

Anyway, this subject has been done to death elsewhere in the comments and on the forums, take a look.

The 7″ tablet PC in question runs Android Linux and you can install custom applications on the device. It’s a very sturdy and well built device with built-in WiFi and camera. Another alternative (cost free) is to use your Android mobile device to deploy and run your newly coded applications.

Cross compilers (SDKs) which target Android, iPhone and other platforms are available. They include emulators so that you can develop and test programs on your existing PC/laptop/Mac/Windows/Linux as if it was running on the target device. Many schools and universities already have PCs and laptops available thus don’t necessarily need to spend more.

Developing an application to run on a tablet PC and mobile (making use of multitouch IO, tilt and pan, camera and graphics at the same time) – at costs lower than the complete working RPi – could be even more motivating/inspiring than doing it on a bare development board.

If you’d like to teach hardware IO programming than you might as well connect a MCU board to the tablet PC/PC/laptop via the USB connector.

The complete RPi setup will actually cost quite a lot so I’d just like to make a point that software development is a multifaceted discipline. I think that a single development board (that emulates how software development was done back in the 80′ on a BBC micro) will not provide a universal solution. For educational purposes it is likely that various teaching tools will need to be used.

By all means purchase RPis – at the list price they are a giveaway – but don’t invest much more. If you’re spending more than £35 or £50 per seat then there are good or better alternatives available.

Targeting Android (and much of your post) *completely* misses the point – to do it you need ANOTHER PC to do the compilation (and a pretty high spec one at that for those who have experienced the Android Dev environment). This project aims to get computers in to the hands of people who don’t have access to computers that they can program on (which isn’t the same as just having access to a computer). I’m also not sure why you have mentioned schools and universities that already have PC’s. If they already have PC’s they don’t need the Raspi anyway, so are not the target audience.

Tilt, pan, multitouch etc? Why? We don’t even have enough people who can write Hello World programs at the moment. Introducing them to all that stuff seems a little premature. Fine once you have a grounding, but not for first principle teaching. Use the Pi to find out who is interested. They can do a lot with it. Then more advanced students move on to bigger machines.

And I reiterate. Those tablets are cheap for a reason (as is the Raspi of course). And completely unsuited to teaching programming, unlike the Raspi. Also, I cannot find one at less than £100 inc VAT, so about 4 times the price.

However, if you want to buy one, go ahead, but please point out better alternatives at £50 per seat, because I don’t know of any. Links required, and evidence they are better for teaching.

And please don’t try to tell me about software development, I’ve been doing it professionally for over 30 years.

> And please don’t try to tell me about software development,
> I’ve been doing it professionally for over 30 years.

Someone with your experience should know that with computing science there are hundreds of different technologies available to learn, select and efficiently make use of. These diverse technologies include various IC solutions, buses, protocols and languages. Each of which provide capabilities to make use of, pose challenges to get integrated and at the same time make the subject interesting to get involved in.

I’ve been involved in the subject for a while having built my first micro (with TV output) back in 1983 by designing a PCB, soldering the components together and writing programs in machine code – so I know a little bit about computing as well :)

> Use the Pi to find out who is interested. They can do a lot with it.
> Then more advanced students move on to bigger machines.

For this reason I’d think that multiple solutions should be used in education rather than creating a hype about just one. Pupils might also have different preferences as to what they’d like to achieve with their applications.

A cost free solution would be to use pupils’ own mobile phones as they run capable ARM cores and Android Linux or iOS operating systems. This could be quite an effective way of teaching as well, getting kids to develop apps they can deploy to their mobiles and share with friends, then publish to Marketplaces and App Store. This assumes that most schools already have PCs and laptops available and can run the SDK and emulator on their host OS.

Any basic Hello World application, no matter whether it’s developed on the Raspi or another platform will need to be accompanied with a set of instructions. Following these instructions might be as easy on a host PC as having it directly run on the target such is the case with the Raspi.

Back to the £58.32 tablet PC:

7″ tablet PC – resistive
http://www.ebuyer.com/287638-scroll-essential-tablet-pc-53511

7″ tablet PC – capacitive
http://www.ebuyer.com/294945-scroll-excel-3d-tablet-pc-53715

It’s getting some good reviews. I’m sure that given the quantities required anyone who is purchasing in quantities would be able to get even better pricing and request that a good quality touch screen is used.

Also a nice wallet/keyboard is available to go with the device:
http://www.ebuyer.com/341842-storage-options-scroll-excel-essential-7-keyboard-wallet-54045

If using Linux in robots and other embedded applications a small Linux board with built-in WiFi might be a good choice:

MiniEMBWiFi Linux board £29.17
http://www.omnima.co.uk/store/catalog/MiniEMBWiFi-p-16180.html
Runs WebUI so it’s easy to add precompiled packages or add scripts written in Lua, Python via a web interface.

An even smaller Linux board:
http://bifferos.co.uk/

These are a few examples of alternatives available in the UK which would be ideal for teaching (have already been used for teaching) and can also be used in real applications as they are CE/FCC certified products.

Yes, I am aware of all those technologies, and more. Not sure what they have to do with grass root programming though. Although I am aware of them, most I have never had to deal with in my programming career (mostly embedded as well, which some may find surprising). I expect the same applies to most of software engineers out there. Once again I find myself having to say that the Raspi is for grass roots programming – to get people interested who wouldn’t otherwise be able to afford it. That includes schools who are always on a budget.

If you want to teach all those bus protocols you are talking more university level teaching – not the aim of the RasPi, although there has been lots of interest in those areas as well. Same applies to the devices you link to – more suited to University level course than schools and primary schools.

And once again I find myself having to say – those tablets are crap for teaching programming (and many who have them would say they are crap FULLSTOP). As are mobile phones etc. You simply cannot use a 640×480, or WVGA screen for editing computer code – its hopeless. Have you ever tried typing in large amounts of computer text with a resistive screen? Don’t bother. It’s too painful. You can of course plug then in to a monitor and keyboard (if supported), but then you are on the same playing field as the Raspi, which is cheaper. Also, unless you have a second PC for cross compiling to Android, the coding abilities are pretty low.

The other devices you link too are fine for their purpose (although less than half the power of the Raspi for a higher price – 150 or 320MHz vs 700Mhz, no GPU, much less memory, but with better I/O, don’t run Linux), but again, unsuited to grass root programming. You can teach low level programming with them of course, just like you could with the Raspi to be honest, but more expensively. Once again, you need a second PC to cross compile the code for them. You don’t for the Raspi – as it runs a full blown linux it can come with compilers etc on board (and will do).

I suggest looking through the educational section of the forum where a lot of this stuff has already been discussed.

Sorry for my english.
I’m from development country.
Not every child have computer, not every child have android or iphone / ipad (of course).
But we can afford $35 Raspberry Pi.

Clear Enough.

still cant wait to get mine

[…] Raspberry Pi input, textarea{} #authorarea{border:#9EBAC7 1px solid; margin:10px 0px; padding:6px 8px […]

CLEAR… !!! Looking forward to buy the computer…

[…] Fuente: Raspberry Pi […]

So what you are saying, is that I can get one in October for $5, but only if I pre-order it from my school’s website?

Yes, that’s right. And we only accept payment in Tongan Pa’anga.

Tongan Pa’anga, that will be 35.00 USD = 58.29 TOP!

We’ve given Raspberry Pi this month (EPE Magazine March 2012 issue) a half page write-up. Also, I’ve erased TH for ever from my own EPE Mag/ Net Work A-Z Best of the Net listing. And I’ve added Raspberry Pi instead :-)

Formal media try to differentiate themselves from bloggers by claiming to be professionally run. What with Toms and Wired handling this story so unprofessionally, you have to wonder where you have to go to be sure you are getting the straight story (Rupert Murdoch is on record as worrying about this self-same issue but look at how unprofessional some of his titles are).

In my blogging, I try to get the story right, and take corrections, and I have a much smaller readership that Toms or Wired. And I don’t make money out of blogging. What happened to good old fashioned self esteem?

The best response to this sort of thing is a large-scale response to incorrect reports from irate readers putting the story straight. But strictly putting the story straight: no angry personal attacks etc. Long-time Apple fans from the days when Apple was small and embattled and subject to ridiculously inaccurate reporting will know how little good it does to be too shrill in your response. People other than the unprofessional editorial staff will read any comments published with the offending article.

Where I can find the full specification ?? and Where can I buy one ??

??? Have you read any of the WIki, FAQ or website?

Yes.. I did.. But there’s nothing about CPU!!

Yes there is. This took me about 5 seconds of searching. Next time I suggest you do your own search.

http://elinux.org/Rpi_Hardware

Fantastic news on the educational package. I am really looking forward to teaching GCSE Computing with the Raspberry Pi. I joined the teaching profession from programming six years ago and this is what we have all been waiting for. I can assure you that we will be using the Pi in education!

I so do wish you would consider doing pre orders. Id like to send one as a gift and a pre-order would be as good as the gift as at least they knew it would arrive when it was ready.

Sorry, but it ain’t gonna happen! If the Foundation were to take pre-orders, what would happen? They would all sell out just as quickly as the real orders when the ‘Pi is launched, except that The Foundation will have your money. It won’t give you or anyone else a better chance of getting one, or of getting it any quicker.

Pre-orders only create an administrative burden and offer no benefit to a funded organisation.
– The only possible benefit is if an organisation can’t get funding any other way.

If they took pre-orders, then as Lynbarn said they’d sell out at the same rate as real devices, except that then there would be a really big list of orders to fulfil once they get the real devices, with no real way of knowing exactly how long they will have to wait to get them.

– They could get lost or damaged in shipping. You’d be surprised how often containers fall off ships! (Insurance will cover that, but there will obviously be a large delay!)
– Customs might spend longer than usual inspecting them.
– If the manufacturing yield is smaller than expected, they end up having to deal with customers who have paid but they have no device to send them.
– If yield is higher than expected, they end up with devices they have to sell first-come-first served, annoying the people who just missed out on the pre-order list.

The last couple have even happened to seats at the London 2012 (Para)Olympics, and they are in a much better position to know exactly how many there are available!

Whereas selling the first-come-first served once the devices are already manufactured, tested and shipped – the exact yield is known, and you can ship to customers immediately.

So pre-orders are just not worth it. End of.

Sometimes I just cannot fathom journalism. Understandably, each newspaper or publication does offer a slant on each article. But when there is not even any justifiable founding for the material, or even accuracy, I refuse to listen to the explanation in fear of being fed further ‘innacuracies’.

On a purely technical point, the sub-head of each page reads “An ARM GNU/Linux box for $25. Take a byte!” yet you have confirmed the (entirely reasonable) £25 and £35 price points. Even presuming that the subheader refers to the ‘A’ model due later shouldn’t the subhead be changed to either a “£” in front or “$39.25” if in USD?

The price is in dollars (and is confirmed in dollars on this post). See the FAQ for reasons why.

Sorry, maybe I wasn’t clear in making my point. “$25” plus local taxes does not equal “£25”. At this moment, $25 is equal to £15.83. Add VAT @20% (£1.58) and you get a total sum of £17.41 – a lot of change from the £25 stated on this post. The days of US companies fleecing UK people by using an exchange rate of £1 = $1 is way behind us, and anyway you are a UK company, so where is the missing £7.59 (30% of the cost!) going?

“At this moment, $25 is equal to £15.83. Add VAT @20% (£1.58) and you get a total sum of £17.41”

I think you need a new calculator ;)

However, don’t forget that even taking the GBP + VAT cost into account there’s still postage to be paid for.

I don’t see any pound signs in that post! You’ll pay what the exchange rate is on the day; there is no missing £7.59.

Will the gertboard be available with relase of raspberry pi?

Disculpen, pero el español es mi lengua materna, ando siguiendo el Raspberry pi des los anuncios del año pasado, me gustaria saber como podria adquirir uno el 20 de Febrero, y eso de los costes de importacion, si se manda por correo seria lo mismo, desde ya muy agradecido por aclarar mis dudas

Mi español no está muy bien (inglés es mi lengua materna), pero trataré. El Raspberry pi estaré listo despues de 20 de Febrero, en raspberrypi.org. podrán comprar de la tienda virtual.

No sé de qué país seas, pero a partir del veintipico de febrero dijeron que van a estar disponibles para la compra en su shop (rasperrypi.com), obviamente con algún tipo de envío internacional.
Lo que sí puede pasar, es que en la aduana de tu país te cobren un extra, por traer un producto nuevo. Todo depende de la legislación donde vivas.

that’s gorgious, it sounds like a joke but it is true…I will adv. into my school and students….best regards…Antonino

Quiero uno de esos maravillosos juguetitos, me resultan algo sorprendente

A new article is needed for the front page. Whilst I appreciate that this isn’t quite the same as a commercial outfit, and that the product is expected to ‘sell’ itself, you do still want the ‘Pi’ to be a widespread success, right?

Speaking as an educator, I have learned to be positive. Don’t tell people what something isn’t. Tell them what it is. Simple language and positive statements. Even at the risk of going over old ground again… what can it do, how much will it cost, when will it be available.

At present, a visitor sees ‘Corrections and clarifications…’ and what does that say? It says Raspberry Pi = controversy. Raspberry Pi = unclear. Raspberry Pi = struggling.

All of which is untrue. So don’t let a single brain-dead tech reporter derail the whole project. Get some footage up of schoolchildren using the ‘Pi’. Ask them what they think about it. Ask them what they want to do with it. Ask them what they’ve discovered.

It’s that simple. (And, incidentally, I’m happy to help, if you need it. You know how to reach me.) Please let’s end this negativity and get the enthusiasm and excitement going again.

They don’t call it Hom’s Tardware for nothing.

[…] students on the Key Stage 2/3 and PGCE programmes. However, in an unexpected development, a blog post on the Raspberry Pi Foundation’s website earlier this week intimated that Raspberry Pis will not be available to education customers until […]

Hardly suprising, Eurogamers reporting is the trashiest on the internet, they constantly spew twisted bile, infact anything that might generate some web traffic for advertisers. They really don’t care about the consequences of their reporting, as long as the ad money keeps rolling in. Parasites is the only word for them.

Unfortunatly, they are not alone, it’s a common trend.

Liz, unless you wish to limit initial sales to build volume slowly, it might be prudent to not assure that the direction of price, if any, will only be one way, down. Skinflints like me might be tempted to prevaricate on purchase in case the price drops.

You can say that about anything – and some people do prevaricate, and never buy at all. Up to you.

Exactly – That’s just the risk you take being an early adopter with any product.

The difference here is that at only $25/35 in the first place, is it really worth waiting weeks or months to save what will likely be a few dollars/pounds?

I am 40 years old and have no programming skills, but it’s somthing that has always interested me. When can I buy a Raspberry Pi and how do I go about using it.

its free shiment? UPS, DHL
to Poland? We very interested this hardware :)
We like embbed systems ;)

I need to buy raspberry pi 35$ model board. Please help me

[…] educational version, available in the fall, “will come with a kid-targeted software stack, a heap of written support materials, and a […]

I just ordered, or pre-ordered, my Pi from Newark, via an Email they sent me very recently.

I have been waiting for something like this to come out. Can’t wait to get my hands on a raspberry pi. I been accused of being a Windows fanboy because of my website but, Ubuntu is actually my favorite OS.

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